October 8, 2009, - 12:06 pm

EXCLUSIVE: Man Slated to be Obama’s Top Immigration Agent Investigated for Embezzlement

By Debbie Schlussel

DebbieSchlussel.com has learned that Robert Schoch, the Special Agent in Charge of Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) for Los Angeles, is under investigation for alleged embezzlement and/or misuse of ICE funds used in undercover operations.  Mr. Schoch and the Los Angeles Deputy Special Agent in Charge, Jennifer Silliman, were escorted from the ICE federal offices in Long Beach, California, and their badges and guns were taken from them (standard procedure when an agent is under investigation and put on leave).  They were both put on administrative leave pending a continuing investigation.  A search warrant was reportedly executed on Agent Schoch’s home, and sources say his computers from both his LAX and Long Beach offices were seized.



Normally, this would be inside baseball stuff.  But Schoch was slated by Obama Administration officials running ICE to be Director of Investigations of ICE, meaning that he would be running and overseeing all ICE investigations worldwide.  His appointment to that position was imminent, even as he was reportedly being investigated by ICE’s Office of Professional Responsibility and, reportedly, the U.S. Attorney’s Office in Los Angeles.  The right hand doesn’t know what the left hand is doing at ICE. . . and doesn’t care.

I contacted ICE’s PR people, yesterday afternoon, regarding this story, and they would neither confirm nor deny it.  However, it’s all over ICE.  Agents are wondering why a man who was, himself, under investigation was chosen and about to be named their agency’s chief investigator.  It sounds like a joke, but it’s very real and, sadly, very typical of the agency for which they work and where morale continues to plummet.

It’s more bad news about an agency that continues to be mismanaged, without aim or specific purpose, and cannibalized by inept and dishonest supervisors and bureaucrats, who use the agency as their own personal harems, “The Bachelorette” show sets, and nightly falalafel dinner opportunities with Muslims galore (that means you, Abu Moskowitz).  And you wonder why illegal aliens continue to laugh at them . . . and us.  I’ll be writing more about ICE’s, um, “leadership” under the Obama/Napolitano regime in the near future (stay tuned).

Schoch is 39 or 40 according to differing accounts.  His rise in ICE with little concrete investigative experience was meteoric and rife with cronyism, NOT law enforcement experience.  Back in 2004, under the Bush Administration, he was briefly Deputy Assistant Director of ICE.  He comes from the former INS.  The same goes for his Deputy, the inexperienced Ms. Silliman, his close friend.

To make matters worse, Agent Schoch’s acting replacement, Kevin Kozak, is another senior manager who not only skipped any practical experience, but he has a history of EEO gender discrimination cases–some of which were proven, sustained by the Equal Employment Opportunities Commission, and settled, with the government paying your tax money (a lot of it) to at least one woman.  He’s no David Letterman, and the cases do not involve any sexual malfeasance, but male v. female promotion and disciplinary decisions (which in many cases in ICE, seem to now discriminate against men in favor of unqualified women).

While I have no idea of Mr. Schoch’s innocence or guilt and have been unable to reach him for comment, you have to ask yourself how this guy could be considered to be the nation’s top investigator in immigration and customs fraud cases.  He doesn’t have the experience.  And now, he’s suspected of something criminal.

The investigation might be prompted by a politically motivated personal grudge by a rival faction within ICE or the competition for the job he was slated to get.  But I doubt it.  Most ICE Special Agents in Charge–like Michigan/Ohio top ICE cop Brian Moskowitz–get away with doing everything but murder.  And they don’t go after them . . . unless it’s very, very serious.

We shall see.  Stay tuned.

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260 Responses

So he definitely gets the job!

Joe on October 8, 2009 at 12:22 pm

Debbie and Joe – perhaps not. ICE may decide there’s nothing to the charges or quietly cashier him out with the federal equivalent of a “golden parachute.” Unless he’s committed murder or rape, he will probably manage to get away with it.

We shall see.

NormanF on October 8, 2009 at 1:26 pm

In light of Charlie Rangle and William ‘Ice Box’ Jefferson that embezzelment charges would be a “Resume Enhancement”.

P. Aaron on October 8, 2009 at 1:46 pm

does it infuriate anyone else seeing those beaners mock us knowing libs would never do anything to kick them out?

GAArchitect on October 8, 2009 at 1:52 pm

Don’t believe any of the nonsense that the Odopey administration puts out about how great of a guy he may be. This guy fits right in with all of the other scumbags they appoint. Napolitano probably has him on speed dial to make sure she/he gets her/his kickbacks.

Jarhead on October 8, 2009 at 1:53 pm

Also, rumors swirling about and alleged affair between the two and using official travel to promote the affair too. Im surprised you didnt make mention of this Deb. Ifedility seems to be the norm here int his agency with the likes JT and his soon to be lovechild too. This is what happens when inexperienced, undeserving individuals get promoted to quickly and in appropriately. What a joke. You can thank Marcy Foreman for that. Thank heavens she is gone. ICE will have to work for years to unF&*# the damage and questionable personnel decisions she made.

ICEberg on October 8, 2009 at 3:49 pm

    I feel that your comments are a bit crazy. To comment about two people having an affair without being sure is really fucked up of you. You need to take into consideration that innocent people may be hurt by the comments you are making.

    NO Name on October 9, 2009 at 10:23 pm

If you do not know Schoch’s age, then obviously your information sources are questionable. Remember, you are a capitalist, not a journalist, just like everyone else. Your job is to entertain, not nessecarily tell the truth.

N: Nice try, but he’s either 39 or 40. Not my job to lie and pick an age. Sadly, the story is true, and that I couldn’t pinpoint his exact age doesn’t make it any less so. Facts are stubborn things. Including the fact that you’ll still be reading me. You just can’t help yourself. DS

NoLongerYourReader on October 8, 2009 at 4:32 pm

    Hi Brother John. Been ahwile since I read anything of yours. Good to see your still kicking it around and have a handle on things. I was legacy USCS, and had heard many a rumor of these antics, especially after the great takeover in 2000 (?), and INS dissappeared at midnight. I have many friends at the POE in Nogales who used to sit around and tell hair raising stories of the stuff that was going on. But it happens in every group setting. The problem is we do NOT make examples of these people often enough for my standards. Oh, yeah we send some poor schmoe to prison every now and then for taking a bribe, but we leave the cream at the top alone. Amazing now as it was then. (Remember the antics in San Diego?) I retired finally from good old DHS, and never looked back.

    Mike Smith IV on October 9, 2009 at 12:24 pm

“(which in many cases in ICE, seem to now discriminate against men in favor of unqualified women).”

Debbie, Can you expand on this please? Perhaps another article?

JJ on October 8, 2009 at 5:20 pm

Did not Obamao say to judge him by those he puts around him. Look at the list, just go through his Czars. He should be judged to be a Chicago lying POS.

Bob A. on October 8, 2009 at 5:54 pm

The whole situation is quite shameful and embarassing to the agency. Assuming it’s true, what were they thinking?

Somewhere in Kenya, a village is missing its' idiot on October 8, 2009 at 6:16 pm

    Somewhere in Kenya, a village is missing its’ idiot – love the screen name. Now I’ve got to have a tee-shirt made with that. Thanks!

    Jarhead on October 8, 2009 at 6:19 pm

On the contrary Iceberg, MF hasn’t actually left, she currently F&*#ing up the ICE Fraud IPR Center, at least until the end of this year. But word has it that there is soon to be an opening in the SAC LA! … Standby

Titanic on October 8, 2009 at 6:26 pm

Sad situation in LA, considering the low morale here already. On top of that, Silliman’s replacement is someone who’s had a plenty amount of smoke engulfing him since INS days. 6 of one, 1/2 dozen of another.

1811inLA on October 8, 2009 at 7:51 pm

So let’s see. We have an acting SAC who treats his agents like pos’s, transfers will be denied en masse, an acting DSAC who no one respects at all, and some GSes and ASACs who have no experience.

1811inLA on October 8, 2009 at 8:05 pm

Much of this exposed corruption is indicative of legacy INS management..(with the exception of FJ). Customs had its own issues but as far as fraud, waste, and abuse INS management needed to be checked. the best of the L-INS were the go getter workhorses (field agents). Fast promoting Barbie Dolls (who sucked their way up quick-this is very true), and buffoons who came straight from USBP (where they weren’t respected) to become an ICE ASAC in LA with only 2 years on in ICE Office of Investigations are 2 examples of what Uncle Bob brought to SAC LA. I have never seen cronyism of this magnitude in over 2 decades of military and federal law enforcement service. While Customs,DEA, FBI, ATF, have all had their share of black sheep…Legacy INS took the cake when it came to pushing people up the ranks who know jack and shit about being a criminal investigator or having worked cases (look at LA ASACS DR, JG, AZ, etc.)..the good ole boy network was in play, pay to play. This needed to happen and many of are ashamed to wear the same badge as some of these people. Most agents out there are in it for the right reason and bust their asses to protect this country and take down dopers, gangsters, child molesters, and gun runners….but beware of politicians with badges who don’t believe that they have to work cases and know this job like the rest of us, to promote up…BUT DON’T assume that all ICE special agents are like this, just like any organization we have our worker bees, politicians, and unfortunately scammers.

Ranger1811 on October 8, 2009 at 8:14 pm

Well, LOS gave us Jim Hayes. What a mess that was.

They flushed him to NYC or wherever else unwanted ICE folks go, with nary a word about the sordid affair.

The rumors are swirling, though, about the mess he left behind and the charges snapping at his heels.

He’ll likely go the way of all ICE screw-ups. Into a cush retirement via a short stay in DC.

Stay on ’em, Deb!

Dan Diego on October 8, 2009 at 8:38 pm

Debbie, It really is amazing to see the people that BHO hangs with. Birds of a feather do in fact fly together. Cheers, Apophis

Apophis on October 8, 2009 at 8:52 pm

    BHO had nothing to do with BS and JS, the both of them and Julie Myers were appointed under GWB.

    Ranger1811 on October 8, 2009 at 11:39 pm

ICE is a horrible mess. To see young ass-monkeys fresh out of college pulling down 135k per year, it makes me sick. Most of the dipshits I see can’t even speak Spanish. There is no ‘professional courtesy’ as there once was from local law enforcement. I remember when two armed INS Agents were arrested by two LAPD officers. Four giant egos in an armed pissing contest, and INS got handcuffed. How could anyone take any law enforcement entity that has costume parties for Halloween? A bunch of pussies with nothing to do, no clear mission to perform and little or no accountability.

#1 Vato on October 8, 2009 at 10:22 pm

    Speaking spanish isn’t the problem (most of our cases are money/weapons/dope/child porn/national security)our mission in OI is clear: much of it is work that the legacy Customs Servie performed well. For Investigations, immigration charges are only a tool to help us get in to set up more serious charges, compel cooperation,or jack the bad guys if we dont have a case. Spanish-that only applies to certain groups…and I”ve never had a problem finding a spanish speaker when working cases that required it. Its finding an Arabic, Armenian, Pashtu, Farsi, Urdu speaker that is tough sometimes when you’re dealing with organized crime or NS.

    My academy class of 24 only had 2 “ass monkey’s” interns fresh out of college (both knew their place and how lucky they were to get picked up). Everyone else came from BP, CBP, ICE DRO, bigcity PD detectives,marshals, former ATF/DEA/USSS/OIG/OSI SA’s, state troopers, Army and Marine Corps Officers /combat veterans. DON’T attack the rank and file. We knock down more doors and prosecute more felons than most 1811s in FLE (i’ve been in more than one FLE agency and ICE LA does quite a lot of street work against felons). DON’T get us confused with ticket punchers who wouldn’t know what DEEP UC means unless they watch a movie.

    What I’ve seen is some local Legacy INS management that brought the bad from their agency into ICE OI and are making us all look bad with their cronyism and BS. INS 1811s performed a lot of work which was administrative arrest/deportation that 1811s of Customs/now ICE, FBI, ATF, DEA do less of or dont do at all..as we concentrated on our job description which is criminal investigator. ICE Investigations is predominantly focused on complex criminal work. ICE DRO handles administrative deport/ACAP (going through jails looking for criminal aliens), the public and other LE gets both confused on a daily basis. 2 different divisions in one agency. The problem is that many former INS folks transferred freely from one branch to another without the proper experience needed to run investigations or detention and removal. These are 2 DIFFERENT career paths and should be treated as such.

    ICE SAC LA (due to Uncle Bob) brought in several people (his cronies) that didn’t possess the amount of work experience as 1811s to fill ASAC billets. This was wrong and very apparent to all working special agents.

    Many INS 1811s who couldn’t handle doing criminal work went to ICE DRO which is another division.Somehow during the merger BS positioned himeself in a way to climb up in the palace. This is a wrong that needed correction (Most of us sensed something wasn’t right) but if these allegations are truly founded, punishment needs to be carried out in accordance with justice and setting the example as LE….and ICE OI leadership needs to step up and set the record straight for the rank and file working agents who bust there backs to protect this country.

    Ranger1811 on October 8, 2009 at 11:10 pm

      Ranger1811 what exactly do you know about what ICE Does? All this crap that you are talking about the Child pornography, drug, Title III’s, IPR that the legacy Customs Agent used to do. Do you know that those are cases being done by state and local police without a college degree? Why are you on this high hourse about Customs. Get over it it no longer exists. You need to come in and drink the koolaid like the rest of ICE. U and the likes of you need to know that ICE is not going anywhere. The hot topic is IMMIGRATION not drugs, not fake Gucci bags and it certaingly isn’t the Title III’s. Please remeber that U can easily be replaced by someone without a college degree who will probably do a much better job at it than you becuase he/she has something called people skills for having to do interviews in jails. ICE is here and IMMIGRATION is not going anywhere. You need to learn Spanish because the Spanish speakers are tired of doing you cases for you.

      NO Name on October 9, 2009 at 10:35 pm

        You truly make me laugh when you talk of “people skills”…determining alienage and removability in the course of a jail interview has nothing to do with the level of people skills a criminal investigator needs to take down cases that actually have impact (organizations crushed, multiple violent defendants getting triple digit sentences, tens of millions seized, etc)…I’ve done every type of interview imaginable and proving immigration violations is the easiest one…its getting immigration related crimes prosecuted that is difficult. Quit bitching and whining about Enforce (which I have taught to many slug like creatures such as yourself), processing, or whatever (i’d love to have some of your kool-aid so that I can delude myself even further). Guys like myself are all around you and push your group’s criminal stats. We are never content or rest on past laurels. We are always learning more everyday even in our 40’s, and becoming better and deadlier agents. We are going nowhere and will continue to charge on in carrying out our oath, regardless of the BS that occurs around here. If YOU don’t like it in Investigations, contact your old friends at DRO to take you in (if you’re not already over there). But my guess is that they probably wouldn’t want you either.
        Peace out homie, gotta go to work-

        Ranger1811 on October 10, 2009 at 4:09 pm

GAO should conduct an audit of all ICE supervisory promotions since 2003; compare them to the promotions in ATF,USSS,DEA and FBI.
Then, examine the career ladders of all, compared to ICE.
The results would be staggering. The congressional committees that have oversight would have a field day.There are so many ICE supervisors that have not been first line supervisors.
The foundation of ICE ‘leadership’ has been fatally inseminated with incontinent, incompetence.

jim bass on October 8, 2009 at 10:25 pm

    Agree 100%, make it like it was in Customs OI when it came time for promotion- you were required to do a case by case review of work you did as case agent, (UC, money rips, DTO’s, Title III’s, multi defendant conspiracy cases, convictions, seizures). The days of only doing admin I-9 inspections/no criminal work in the INS and still getting promoted are over.

    Ranger1811 on October 8, 2009 at 11:30 pm

Debbs, your sources were a little late but on the money. Uncle Bobby (more like Jr.) was nice enough to field agents but was known as a political beast who was suspected of having some “giant” Rabbis. Lack of experience and insight was the rule of the day. Most of these folks always know whats best and were/are never open to suggestions or advice on investigative matters. These two personnel actions might have a dynamo effect, so stand by…
I would like to echo the previous writer, LOS ICE agents are regularly going after gang members, pedophiles, drug traffickers,smugglers here and abroad and should not be tainted by this incident. Headquarters/DC bears some responsibility in all this. LOS is the largest field ofc. in the country and deserves a competent SAC.
Stick with this blood trail Debbs!

L: Huh? What do Rabbis have to do with it? Not sure how my sources were late. He was only just walked off the premises and put on leave. Pls. explain. DS

Leonidas @ Thermopolye on October 8, 2009 at 11:54 pm

    DS: I meant no slight toward you or your religion when I wrote Rabbis, you know that this term in government circles is akin to Godfather, Benefactor, Protector or Sponsor…in the future I shall endeavor to use these other non-religion labels.
    Next point: I wrote that your souces were somewhat late, I qualify this by pointing out that events began unfolding last friday at COB and by 0900 hrs on monday these actions had “blown up” and word was being put out to the field in an effort to avoid rumours.You wrote about this on thursday 10/9, my words were not meant to demean your sources.
    Lastly, KK may have his work related issues but he does have experience and he is eminently qualified for the job. Never the less he has been a bad judge of character at times by being the “Godfather” of some real nuts. These nuts have been recognized as such by other agencies and by other SAC offices within ICE. There are some nuts who are decent investigators, but they are nut jobs just the same.
    What KK doesnt tolerate is incompetence, the legacy INS folks who were competent investigators have always been recognized as such by the legacy Customs managers and field agents.
    JG demands excellence but has no experience in his portfolio, he is a micro-manager as the work day is long. Still, there are much worse than him.

    Leonidas @ Thermopolye on October 9, 2009 at 7:53 pm

I am sorry to hear about this situation. If true, this is not the first case of high level corruption from both legacy Customs and INS management since ICE was created. ICE is a political animal unlike legacy Customs Office of Investigations. Immigration is now and has always been run by politicians with varying agendas. Politics is a business that is even more dirty than the drug business. Sad but true.

Bonzer Wolf on October 9, 2009 at 12:58 am

In your article Debbie, to set the record straight, the acting SAC Kevin Kozak does have EEO complaints on his record and has been known to be quite Mr Gruff, but he is actually a career 1811 who knows this job aeons more than BS and JS. He had some of the most respected ASACS in LA working for him too (JM,SL, and to be promoted PW, all have tremendous street cred as working agents/cops). Lets hope HQ sends down some real leadership to begin clean up..

Ranger1811 on October 9, 2009 at 1:08 am

    Ranger are you legacy C or I? Seems like you have a lot of info. Txh

    Barry McCockiner on October 9, 2009 at 11:09 am

keep it up.

nokiddings on October 9, 2009 at 1:50 am

Where’s the affidavit???? PLEASE POST IT!!!

1811inLA on October 9, 2009 at 2:26 am

Why should anyone be surprised that someone accused of embezzlement would be lifted by Obama to a lofty position? Obama has appointed enumerable “czars” who are Marxists, a eugenicist, racists, pedophilia promoters, etc.

And BTW, the American people voted a Marxist kokroach into the presidency, a kokroach that couldn’t normally get approved for a low level security clearance.

Go figure.

Hostile Knowledge on October 9, 2009 at 5:50 am

President Kokroach has won the Nobel Peace Prize.

This is the world on LSD.

Hostile Knowledge on October 9, 2009 at 6:03 am

My name is well known among ICE and the “empty suits” from the old US Customs. I have great respect for the good, honest and hardworking ICE special agent, suprvisor or manager. After the arrest of retired ICE mid-level official Rchard P. Cramer in September 2009 on cocaine trafficking by the DEA and the sentence of ICE’s HQ top level official to serve 7 1/2 years in the federal pen for bribery and corruption related charges, going back several years when Chavez was the Customs Attache in Venezuela. The Chavez and Cramer case are very similar: both were at one time, Customs internal affairs agents, both worked in Arizona, both served in highly coveted foreign offices. Cramer served two tours, Chavez served one tour in Mexico came back to Arizona where he got promoted again and sent to Venezuela. The story about Robert Schoch and his corruption activities. Like Vincent Picard, the ICE media guy when asked about Richard Cramer, he was very deceptive telling news reporters that ICE doesn’t keep track (records) of how many employees Cramer supervised when he was the RAC in Nogales, AZ. Then the current ICE SAC Matthew Allen in charge of all ICE offices in Arizona is asked about Cramer. He has no comments. Of course he has none since Matthew Allen worked for Richard Cramer as a group supervisor in Nogales, AZ in 2002. Cramer worked for James “Breck” Ellis who suddenly retired after a US Treasury’s OIG investigation found major inconsistences in a fatal accident involving the death of a Customs agent from Douglas, AZ. Greg John Rabeler, another Arizona GS-1811-15 suddenly retired along with Ellis. Cramer in the late 1990s worked with Traci Lembke. When Lembke went to HQ, Robert W. Weber who was running Customs-ICE OPR, moved to Tampa, FL to replace old Frank Figueroa. Now the question of the century: the Legacy US Customs and ICE have policies regarding employees who are under investigation. They cannot be relocated, promoted or given any awards, etc. As a result, in Customs an innocent employee who was disliked for whatever reason (s), would call the “dogs” or “headhunters” and order them to initiate a malicious internal investigation on that employee. In closing, the current ICE SAC Miami is another croonie. I happen to read his bio and like hundreds of other old Customs and now ICE managers used a particular “operation” they allegedly worked and it is why they deserve to be Senior Service Executives SACs etc. The SAC Miami used “Operation Casablanca” – may be he worked as a busboy or “mandadero’ a boy that goes to the store to get more beer for the bosses. We should expect to see more arrests at ICE since the integrity of ICE has placed at the lowest of its priorities. Since the early 1980s we knew that there was something wrong with Richard Cramer but unfortunately the Treasury’s OIG and DHS-OIG ignored numerous reports. Now is pay time.

John Smith on October 9, 2009 at 6:47 am

    Most of your comments were dead on except for the insinuation on Matt Allen. SAC Allen is/was an outstanding field agent, supervisor and manager. Matt is, by all rights, the best pick in the Agency for Director. He along with Kumar are two of the very few qualified managers in OI.

    SSA in AZ on October 9, 2009 at 11:34 pm

Well, it looks like our Government has finally descended into the corruptocracy previously inhabited only by Governments such as Russia, Syria, Venezuela, Rhodesia and their cohorts. Even though they may not have wanted each incident of corruption to be publicized, it looks like, on the whole, they are abandoning any pretense of a clean, honest government. They are throwing it in our faces, and saying, in effect, “so what”, there’s nothing we can do about it.

Little Al on October 9, 2009 at 7:37 am

    Little Al

    Quick question: You made a lot of sense in your post but when you used Rhodesia were you meaning Zimbabwae since 1980 or actually referring to when it was still Rhodesia? Just curious because it was certainly better then than it is there now.

    1smithfan on October 9, 2009 at 5:16 pm


Don’t get caught up on the term “Rabbi”. Its just a term people throw out in circles that you have someone “looking over you” to help your cause or get you where you want to be. Has nothing to do with religion or the profession of a Rabbi.

ICEberg on October 9, 2009 at 7:59 am

Sounds exactly like the FAA. Those that can’t do the job, get supervisor positions. The favoritism, brown-nosing, and the “self-help” then begin in earnest.

chris on October 9, 2009 at 10:43 am

Has anyone ever heard of a legacy INS agent attempting to pull over a load vehicle by utilizing an undercover recreational vehicle (RV)while he was an agent in LA? Not that would be off the hook!

Barry McCockiner on October 9, 2009 at 11:52 am

And everyone asks why I retired early out of ICE/FAA ? the level of incompatence would make your hair stand on end if you didn’t pull it all out because of frustration. Effing glad I am not there anymore, stuff em! may they all rot in hell !

Drakken on October 9, 2009 at 11:53 am

WHERE’S THE AFFIDAVIT?!?!?!?! We need to see all these details and who is the case agent. The IA investigators are all friends of Schoch and Silliman and worked with Guzman and Kozak. How is anyone going to be charged with any malfeasance?

1811inLA on October 9, 2009 at 3:04 pm

How about management at LAX, San Bernardino, the OC and elsewhere? Are they involved in any way with Schoch’s shennanigans? A LOT of the ASAC people partied with Schoch at USC football games and golfed with him, in particular one ASAC at LAX that I had heard about.The dirty laundary will come out.

fedupinlaandwantstoleave on October 9, 2009 at 3:07 pm

    Hey man, leave ICE’s sleeper cell out of this. We may be the dumping ground but that’s no reason to try and sling more mud on us than already exists.

    BringBackACAP on October 9, 2009 at 3:17 pm

      They should bring back acap. Train vets from Iraq that are limited mobility and set them up to interview the aleins in a line like a factory. You don’t need a lot of training physically for this acap thing, its like a jail booking process. Ideal for guys in wheel chairs folks with more mobility can move and transport the prisoners. What a great way to take care of our brothers.

      Wladimir on October 9, 2009 at 8:02 pm

The affidavit is probably sealed. And I doubt that in a situation like this they would use ICE IA, probably DHS OIG/OPR investigators. I’m sure there’s a lot of oversight occuring within this situation to make sure no mistakes are being made.

BringBackACAP on October 9, 2009 at 3:12 pm

    Schoch has a TS/SCI when you get that clearance you sign a waiver regarding searches of your residence. More than likely they didn’t need a warrant it they conducted a search of the res.

    BM: Can you please pick a different, non-sexually explicit screen name for your comments on this site? If not, then please do not comment. It’s kind of offensive, not to mention something a teen boy (or, these days, also a teen girl) would do. Thanks, DS

    Barry McCockiner on October 9, 2009 at 3:59 pm

      DS, this has been my name since 10/11/1972, actually my brothers name is Jack if you believe that! Regards BM

      Mr. McCockiner on October 10, 2009 at 3:23 pm

Your nuts. You must be legacy INS with a stupid statement like this. You would def need a warrant to go into his residence in this situation. So many people have SCI/TS clearances in various branches of the government. Just because you have a clearance doesnt mean authorities can just go in to your place without a warrant.


Hell, if ICE didnt inherit so much dead wood and problems from the old INS, ICE wouldnt have a lot of the integrity issues it has now, not to say customs wasnt without its share. Like that individual with the drinking problem who got demoted to sit at the front window greeting people at the downtown LA ICE office. Wonderful. The man has no business being a SAC,let alone acting SAC, especially with all the heat he brought down on the LA office with the numerous complaints, some frivolous, some not regarding the mentioned EEO issues. And there are many over the years. And the individual does not know how to treat people from the rank and file to other managers. G_d help the LA office. its a mess and only gonna get worse. That guy hates old school INS people from what I heard..

ICEberg on October 9, 2009 at 5:15 pm

    Iceberg Are you retarded? They used the old Customs SUbpeona to get into the residence (LOL) and he was asking for a copy of the warrant not whether they actually had one. But of course you did not read it properly and you want to sit there and comment about Legacy somebody (meaning Customs/INS (Just so your clear)).

    NO Name on October 9, 2009 at 11:28 pm

Say whatever you want about the INS, but we did the job nobody else wanted, or wants now. Handling aliens.

BringBackACAP on October 9, 2009 at 5:55 pm

    Sounds like the job you desire is working in ICE Detention and Removal not Investigations. There is nothing wrong with that. Those that like “handling aliens” as their primary duty should be where they are happy. I chased and handled enough aliens/criminal aliens in the mean green (USBP) to know the business and how screwed up INS management was. ACAP (fishing the jails for criminal aliens) is not 1811 GS-13 work in ICE that is why ICE Investigations no longer does it. In legacy INS 1811 special agents did this function amongst many other duties. It is important work but can be done by an IEA (immigration enforcement agent/deportation officer) saving the taxpayer money. There is a big difference and much bigger impact between doing single scheme 1326’s (felony reentry after deport) prosecutions, and taking down a 100 defendant violent criminal conspiracy (i.e. street gang) using RICO statute and VICAR. We can do both in investigations but we get paid the not so big bucks to “dismantle” organizations and put serious time on criminals, not to troll jail cells doing an important job that can be done by GS-9 1801 series.

    Ranger1811 on October 9, 2009 at 7:09 pm

      So you mean to tell me that you are shitting on the very hand that fed you? U are former BP (which was under the old INS) and U think that because U arrived in ICE (NOT CUSTOMS) yesterday you know everything? Many cases start out by talking to poeple and doing interviews in jails and on the street. Really, what do you really think Customs do talk to fake Gucci bangs and mangos? Did you know that as a humna smuggler you make more money than a drug trafficker and the penalties are less severe. For your information drug traffickers are becoming aware of that fact. Once again IMMIGRATION Rules.

      NO Name on October 9, 2009 at 11:23 pm

        From the way you talk I know you have done jack and shit as a criminal investigator (if you did you wouldn’t be running your sewer as you have)..Being former INS myself, and knowing several of the best agents across the U.S. from L-INS (mostly ASU and gang types), I can say for all to hear clearly: Immigration does not rule, in L-INS there was more corruption, cronyism,unqualified management than other agencies in FLE…Its funny how you mention mangos and rubix cubes when old Customs (even with their hostile work environment) busted our humps infiltrating and ripping up organized crime and terrorist organizations(check Operation Green Quest, Casablanca, and then talk to me)…this was done by the art of knowing how to deal with “people” ,interviewing skills, UC work. Memorizing Natz charts at IOBTC and knowing Spanish doesnt make you a criminal investigator, it may make you a good immigration inspector. The rest of us have accepted that and have gone forward and done our best at every job that we’ve been given. Quit your whining, embrace reality, and most importantly if you are legit, hit the field and get some gangsters and guns off the streets (and use the INA and doing so instead of whining about worksite enforcement and mangos or rubix cubes)-

        Ranger1811 on October 10, 2009 at 12:42 pm

      Mike Dunn, tell us what criminal work you’ve completed. Lay out your investigations and indictments on the board so we can see them. Tell us how many long term investigations, where you were the case agent, you’ve done. Can’t speak for anyone else, but if I had a choice of being a GS-13 working 1326’s or a GS-13 doing a wire, well I guess I’ll choose the 1326.

      BringBackACAP on October 13, 2009 at 2:09 pm

        That’s easy UP15, then GQ05, GQIQ, and a MICO, you’ll see the whole gig. Good luck bro.

        TECS Guru on October 13, 2009 at 11:00 pm

        FWIW, Walker and ranger1811 are not one in the same. They’re screen names are similiar and were both BP but walker was never USCS.

        SabesQue on October 15, 2009 at 12:13 am

I’ve heard the same about KK, that he doesn’t regard INS agents as “true investigators”. But his sidekick is Jorge Bin Lying. So we shall see what happens in LA, the soon to be hell hole.

fedupinlaandwantstoleave on October 9, 2009 at 6:11 pm

When Customs and INS merged all the experienced Customs guys knew what was to come and they all left. As messed up as INS was instead of getting rid of the problem they left them in place and merged them with Customs.

When all the experienced Customs guys left guess who was left behind to promote? Guess where all the INS problems ended up?

Rooster5150 on October 9, 2009 at 6:19 pm

    Not exactly true…the experienced Customs Special Agents who stayed, along with some pups that they trained up (post merger ICE special agents hires) and maybe a few locked on Legacy INS agents (who pulled a train full of slugs in INS days) are still generating and taking down serious cases. This is the only thing left to redeem this agency and show the public that there are some of us that are actually worth a damn as criminal investigators. Our management under BS certainly didn’t do it for us…All that is left for us in the field is our loyalty to duty and the oath that we took.

    Ranger1811 on October 9, 2009 at 6:55 pm

I see Jorge Guzman is mentioned. They can’t really let him out from under his rock can they? That guy is a crook from a family of crooks

Wladimir on October 9, 2009 at 7:56 pm

The merger of the former INS & Customs Offices of Investigation into Immigration & Customs Enforcement(ICE)was a huge mistake. The agency was dead on arrival. I wrote that in 2003 and the agency has proved me to be correct since then.

DEA was formed by merging drug investigators from BNDD & Customs. ICE was formed by merging GS/13 criminal investigators with some GS/12 criminal investigators and hundreds of detention officers. Customs agents were required to have college degrees and complete the criminal investigative training school at the FLETC in Glynco, Ga. INS had no education requirement and did not complete CIS training at the FLETC. In fact, many INS agents came from the Border Patrol, which does not even require a high school diploma.

After the merger, all journeymen agents became GS/13 senior special agents. The legacy agents received one week of training in each others duties. New ICE agents now receive over 16 weeks of such training in addition to CIS.

ICE is an absolute and total failure. Age discrimination, lack of training, and the forced merger of two completely different cultures, expertise, and investigative jurisdiction doomed ICE from day one.

Bonzer Wolf on October 9, 2009 at 8:54 pm

    I disagree with how bleak many paint the picture for ICE as a whole, much of the problem in ICE OI is tied with some of the issues you mention in the culture of the ” I” of our authority. Immigration IS a useful authority to have for agents investigating dope, money laundering, OC, or terrorism (I’ve used it as a hook to set up a big beast for the kill). It is the lax, wasteful culture from Legacy INS that needs to be routed out of ICE OI and ICE as a whole. This can be fixed easier than many people will admit. As we hire more and more locked on agents as well as laterals (who are coming in droves from USSS, OSI, NCIS, and many other agencies), a lot of the negative stain of the old INS will be washed away. Not that Customs, ATF, DEA, FBI, CIA hasn’t had its share of black sheep, because they have but not to the magnitude of the old INS.

    I can see some of the reasons for the disbanding of the INS as we knew it..Regardless of what has happened, on the field level, the agents left from the “C” of ICE, some aggressive new ICE special agents, and locked on former INS agents have made ICE Investigations more professional and held to a higher standard than legacy INS…but these events prove that there is still work to be done in cleaning up our house. Plan for action: Merge ICE with CBP (combining investigators with their uniformed inspectors- as it was before the merger for Customs), As mentioned before, conduct a GAO review of all ICE supervisors brought on under BS and hold them to the same 1811 supervisor standard as legacy Customs, FBI, ATF, DEA. -There will obviously always be cronyism and politics in LE agencies, but we must prevent the hiring of unqualified politicians or their cronies to be supervisors, ASACS, SACs etc. Throw their SSN’s on TECS and see what they did as AGENTS before they’re even considered for promotions. Age doesn’t always correlate with experience as I’ve seen many people with 4 years on in ICE investigations smoke some Legacy INS GS-13s who did little criminal work. Experience is gained by actually learning and embracing our authority Customs AND Immigration, not pointing fingers, and getting the job done….with experience comes knowledge. What happened with BS was powerful Rabbis bringing up someone with little knowledge and little experience. He in turn did the same thing and brought a few underlings that were birds of the same feather. Now maybe DC will wake up and mandate a serious house cleaning…most field agents would jump at this in joy…

    Ranger1811 on October 9, 2009 at 9:58 pm

      Ranger1811 Please hand in your badge and gun on Monday and go with CBP. Another merger would really kill ICE. CBP has its own isues and ICE needs to clean out its house. U need to buy a clue. If you love CBP so much go back. Leave ICE!

      NO Name on October 9, 2009 at 11:43 pm

Ranger1811 said: “For Investigations, immigration charges are only a tool to help us get in to set up more serious charges, compel cooperation,or jack the bad guys if we dont have a case.”

That is so true and it is a perfect reason why Border Patrol should be allowed to work inland. ICE simply is NOT going to pick up Pedro (and Pietro and Franz and Marcel and Nobuko) unless he is evidence of a bigger crime. Slightly off topic, but I couldn’t let that quote go without throwing this out there.

And where IS that indictment anyway?

INScop on October 9, 2009 at 9:43 pm

    In an ideal world free of the chains of politics, ICE DRO would be allowed to be the internal USBP and conduct mass sweeps for illegal aliens in downtown LA, Home Depot, wherever..but we all know that this will not happen (just like dropping a nuke in Northwest Pakistan where Bin Laden is hiding)..To all Immigration Law Nazis, get over it…That is why I support hard core fines being levied against big business that supports this, the pocket book is where it hurts.
    An unchecked capitalist system is all about the bottom line profit..and our fellow American business owners turn a bigger profit hiring Juan, Jorge, etc…most big businessmen wave flags during 4th of July but truly don’t give a shit about the working man in America. This is reality…and its too late. So as investigators when we do apply INA based law it is onto targets that we can get prosecuted or removed due to their hard core criminal activity or suspected threat to national security. The immigration system is simply overwhelmed and broken when it comes to removing non criminal aliens..and that is unfortunately the fault of the American system.

    Ranger1811 on October 9, 2009 at 10:19 pm

      Ranger1811 Do you watch or read the news? Going to Walmart was somethin gthat ICE did and was scrutinized to the T. What planet are you on. ICE does those types of investigations it is called worksite.

      NO Name on October 9, 2009 at 11:54 pm

        No name if you watched the news or worked at SAC LA you would know that the US Attys Office here DOES not prosecute most worksite cases, and that our sole group dedicated to worksite has their hands COMPLETELY TIED. I am convinced that you have never walked 301 Ocean, LAX, or 300 North LA st to be making comments like that. Don’t lecture those who are dealing with this mess, being real Police (I doubt you would understand this term if worksite enforcement gets your panties wet), and trying to do the best they can for this country.

        Ranger1811 on October 10, 2009 at 12:08 pm

Gee Debbie- you can tell by the number of comments that ICE hasn’t been a topic of discussion for a long long time. A lot of pent up frustration and people making up for lost time. Things are no better now than they were under JM. Unfortunately now the agency is actually run by know nothing Arizona Mafia trash without an ounce of law enforcement experience.

To Dan Diego – the world awaits the fate of the evil one. Agencywide knowledge about record numbers of EEOs filed by upper level managers and subordinates. Inappropriate relationships with subordinates. Questionable travel arrangements at added expense to the government. Inappropriate acceptance of benefits from subordinates. Retaliatory actions on whistle blowers. And yet he continues to supervise hundreds and still gets a paycheck. Amazing.

justwhenyouthinkitcantgetworseatice on October 9, 2009 at 10:04 pm

Jorgy Porgy is a catastrophic mistake for DSAC LA. He is an arrogant SOB who doesn’t blink when throwing someone under the bus. He is not to be trusted. KK is insane to think JG, someone with his own track record of EEO complaints against him, will do more good than harm. At least JS made attempts to increase morale. JG’s presence alone has all morale in the crapper. He is reason enough to transfer! You are right, just when you think it can’t get worse!

AlphaB417 on October 9, 2009 at 10:34 pm

On a detour off of BS and JS and their elite club of insiders, I would like to state that the “new breed” of ICE agents coming out of the academy are an impressive bunch. The majority of them hit the ground running with good attitudes and great potential. Ironically, some of the best new agents are ex-border patrol so I dont see a BP background as a detriment and I dont see ICE as being doomed. ICE just needs to ensure that promotions are based on merit so that when we legacy types retire with our prejudices, the agency will go on and prosper. The merger was a mistake but its done and its here to stay and we need to do all we can to make it the most kick ass agency of them all. But this transition wont happen when we have these bands of “Young Turks” who are politically connected calling the shots. Again, Washington needs to be held accountable for all those whom they put into powerfull positions. From the famous ingrates such as “PepperMint Patty” to the well tailored crooked bobbies.

Leonidas @ Thermopolye on October 9, 2009 at 10:48 pm

    Leonidas I disagree with you about the new ICE Agents. Alot of the ones out of the academy refuse to enforce the Immigration Law and have no clue on how to process. Some of them refuse to learn. ICE is in need of people that will not be criticizing it to state, local and federal agencies. Saying things that make ICE look like crap is horrible and should not be tolerated. New agents who come to ICE and say that they are Customs need to be fired. Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) is the name given to this agency and all of those who work for it and especially the ones who took an oath to uphold the law need to remeber that each and every day. Customs no longer exists. If they want they can go to CBP IA and work for them. I hear they have plenty of work (LOL).

    NO Name on October 10, 2009 at 9:54 am

What a joke. Look at the gotahsow at ASAC JFK that is runnning the show. She was protected by her sister. Where the hell was DHS OIG on that one? A fine example of people being protected because of loyalties. Oh peppermint patty ruining the IPR center and making everyone miserable

Debbie, will you PLEASE put up that Seinfeld rendition photo of Torres on the couch? THat is priceless.

Why did Dora Schriro really leave ICE? Wasit maybe because she saw how FUBAR’d ICE really was? if so, that is a lead to follow up on because the matter of fact is is that its an unfixable sitauation with current regime of knuckleheads in ICE management, specifically DRO.

Whose that foold from SAC LA that wrote the search warrant for the location that burned down several years prior to the swearing out of the warrant? A classin tale. and he was legay INS.

One can only hope and pray A/S Morton will fix thing and in the short time, there are primising signs but he can only do what the administration lets him to do.

ICECHUNK on October 9, 2009 at 11:34 pm

Who was the fool in ICE who purchased $17,500 worth of candlewax? A legacy Customs guy (hired after the merger) and was a big Customs man.

NO Name on October 9, 2009 at 11:46 pm


mike on October 9, 2009 at 11:57 pm

Wow! I thought most of the Legacy Customs Prima Donnas had let the door hit them in the butt by now. If you still miss the days of Customs “work”, put in you application with CBP Internal Affairs. This way you can jam up an inspector who misidentifies a counterfeit rubrics cube. Better yet, join the NFTTU. Talk about a bunch of Legacy Customs bozos. Your rank and file ivory tower customs agents still can’t figure out a GS-5 database (Enforce) after 6 years. Why don’t you keep having contraband cases (drugs & CP) handed to you by BP and CBP Officers. Maybe one day you might attempt to prosecute a case where you have to prove knowledge like alien smuggling, visa fraud, worksite, or a Strat investigation. Don’t forget to oil your rusty handcuffs.

18 Bravo on October 10, 2009 at 12:06 am

Ooooh nice one 18 Bravo!! I thought strat aka strategic cases were legacy Customs diciplines? As far as Enforce is concerned, everytime we approached you guys (immediately post merger)to give training presentations on this database, 99 percent of you bowed out citing the most preposterous of reasons (probably because y’all didnt understand it either!). The only guy who knew it back then and who could teach was BB in Gangs II. Yeah, a lot of you keep making the rubics cube and widgets cracks but you forget the tons of cocaine and the routine million dollar seizures of drug proceeds that were made before the rubic cubic cubes and widgets. 🙂

Leonidas @ Thermopolye on October 10, 2009 at 12:22 am

    18 Bravo I agree with you 100%. Leonidas needs to realize that the L-Customs agents became L-INS admin case workers. L-Customs agents are just mad that the L-INS agents figured out their trick about stealing stats from other agencies. Also, politicians figured it out to and that is why they merged them with INS.

    NO Name on October 10, 2009 at 10:06 am

Does anyone know if BS, great initials, and JS will return to SAC/LA after all is said and done? No matter what happens, it will be a club of insiders who get promote and their little cronies will get the goodies.

mike on October 10, 2009 at 12:27 am

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