October 12, 2012, - 1:20 pm

Chia Joe v. Paul Ryan Debate Photo Says It All About Al-Gore-Annoying Nutty Veep, But Who Won?

By Debbie Schlussel

**** UPDATE: I forgot to mention (and thanks to astute reader and author Stephen Schochet for reminding me) how disgusted I was with Paul Ryan’s constant pandering to and support of the Syrian Muslim Brotherhood/Al-Qaeda terrorist “rebels” as “freedom fighters.” His criticism of Biden and Obama for calling Assad a reformer is accurate, but PUH-LEEZE, does he believe these scumbags will be better? They will be worse. Also nauseating to me was Paul Ryan’s PC answer that he agreed with the decision to court martial members of the U.S. Armed Forces who risked their lives and saw many of their friends die, merely because they pissed on the bodies of Afghan Muslim terrorists who tried to murder them. Where is this guy’s balls on these issues? ****

I think last night’s night’s Vice Presidential Debate between Joe Biden and Paul Ryan was a wash in terms of “who won”–meaning changing the existing polls in any way. But I think the photo below captures much of what happened. Okay, it doesn’t say everything because there isn’t one of Joe Biden’s gazillion obnoxious, arrogant, Al-Gore-Annoying smirks in the photo. I have a word for it, a “Smirkin” (as in merkin), ‘cuz that’s what Biden constantly wore last night, to cover up his inadequacy. I listened to the beginning on my car radio while I was driving, but when I got home and saw the rest on TV, it was night and day because of the smirking and other obnoxious Biden facial expressions that you don’t hear or know of on a radio broadcast. The pic is a nice encapsulation of what a nutjob this is. Below are some of my tweets from last night (follow me on Twitter). I must give credit to my friend Ben P. for the tweet about the sub sandwich–a comment he made in the the Sukkah during the Jewish holiday of Sukkot, last week. And by the way, I refreshed my Twitter followers’ memories on my photo comparison of Joe Biden pre-plugs in 1988 and post-Barbie-plugs 2008. They laughed and one of my followers, “Patykayks,” said he went from scalped to “Chia Joe.” Spot on.

Who won last night’s debate in your mind and why?

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44 Responses

Ryan won just by showing up….he has class, composure, confidence, professionalism, and knows what he’s talking about. Biden is an f’ing nutjob; I think he’s been off his meds too long.

IceNoMore on October 12, 2012 at 1:33 pm

    Joe.Biden forces many Christians to pray for Nobama’s life… after all, Joe is one heart beat from power. That would be even more tragic that the current situation…

    As goes Israel, so goes the World... on October 12, 2012 at 2:39 pm

First, I agree with Debbie..this debate did not move anyone either way. People don’t normally worry about the vice presidential position when voting for President, with the possible exception of 2008, which the Republicans were going to lose anyway when McCain just gave up.

With the exception of his Tourettes type tics, Biden argued and debated well, and rest assured Obama was taking notes. Romney better be ready for the Biden style recap that Obama will try to dish out. Obama will be ghetto nasty in the next debate (although I doubt he will threaten to “cap” Romney). And for those who will accuse me of being racist, stugots!! (that’s Italian, for those rushing to look up the definition).

Jonathan E. Grant on October 12, 2012 at 1:56 pm

    People don’t vote for the Vice President. I think Ryan would make a perfectly capable President if something happened to Mitt Happens in office and his performance reassured people.

    A month ago I would have said Obama looked set to be re-elected. Now that’s changed because people were looking for a reason to vote again him and in no poll throughout the year has he broken 50%.

    All Mitt Happens has to do in the next two weeks is to look presidential. This is not a good year to be an incumbent – not with the economy in serious trouble and the enormous debt Obama has saddled upon America.

    NormanF on October 12, 2012 at 2:07 pm

Debbie, did you hear Ryan called the Syrian rebels “Freedom Fighters”?

SS: Yes, and his constant comments about how we should be helping them nauseated me. I meant to mention that. Thanks for reminding me. Updating now. DS

Stephen Schochet on October 12, 2012 at 1:56 pm

It won’t tilt the race back to Obama.

I have to award the debate to Ryan on points. Biden’s boorish behavior didn’t win any one over who wasn’t already going to vote for Obama.

It looks like Mitt Happens will be our next President.

NormanF on October 12, 2012 at 2:00 pm

I don’t do the Twitter stuff at all. Why can’t you just do everything here?

Anyway, I would have socked that arrogantly rude, horse smiling, Biden if I were Ryan. I would love to have slapped that condescending grin off his face. I want him and Zero out of the WH ASAP!

J Bodine on October 12, 2012 at 2:02 pm

    J Bodine sez:

    “I don’t do the Twitter stuff at all. Why can’t you just do everything here?”

    Why can’t you do nothing here; i.e., why don’t you scram?

    skzion on October 14, 2012 at 12:13 pm

Stephen Schochet can you give the minute/second Ryan made the comment? If you quote, make notes.

cassandra on October 12, 2012 at 2:06 pm

Get it ALL in Stephen before we run out of time. Convince people to just stay home and not vote troll boy. That’ll guarantee Zero gets elected fool.

J Bodine on October 12, 2012 at 2:07 pm

    Bodine is another foul tempered Mittens troll.

    skzion on October 14, 2012 at 12:15 pm

I would still bet that Obama will be re-elected. Romney was right when he said that the 47% getting a federal check will vote for Obama. Toss in enough white women votes and a few left wing commie votes, illegal alien votes, and dead voters voting, and Obama has the election sewn up.

People love their free phones, free cheese, 8a housing vouchers allowing them to live in upper class neighborhoods, free tuition, welfare payments (with the work requirement eliminated), Aid to Dependent Children benefits, free food stamps, free lunches and breakfasts at schools, free computers, free internet service, etc.

Jonathan E. Grant on October 12, 2012 at 2:14 pm


If it was over 50%, you’d be absolutely right. Mitt Happens is a terrible candidate in many ways but he can do no harm. Obama will change America into one of a perpetually dependent nation going into the sunset like the UK was before Thatcher came along.

In an ideal world, we would all love to have another Ronald Reagan. We have to settle for what we can get. And if you’re right – we’ll never see another Republican win the White House in our lifetime.

Pray that Obama does lose next month.

NormanF on October 12, 2012 at 2:22 pm

I’ll try this one last time. Romney and others have incorrectly formed ideas about Islam out of IGNORANCE. They can be educated.

Zero and pals actively support and align themselves with the Muslim Bro hood with FORESIGHT and careful planning. They know exactly the players involved and have chosen sides based leftist agendas. They’re already educated.

DD: Stop making excuses. Both Romney and Obama are EXACTLY THE SAME on the issues of Islam, the Middle East, Immigration, and National Security. Romney is NOT ignorant. He’s a fraud. Oh, and you really want a man who is still ignorant after 65 years on earth and 11 plus years since the 9/11 attacks to be your Prez? You think he’ll suddenly “educate” himself out of his ignorance now? Fool. You excuses are laughable. We have zero choices in this election, despite your absurd fantasy otherwise. DS

Dilbert Delaney on October 12, 2012 at 2:25 pm

The sad thing is, this condescending, rude azz is a heartbeat away from the presidency.

Road Warrior on October 12, 2012 at 2:34 pm

Biden will melt down if the BO Team loses.
He is so removed from the middle class,
it takes a 50 car motorcade to buy dental floss.

Commander Zero on October 12, 2012 at 3:02 pm

Biden won. Style and emotion always trump substance, absent a blunder like Palin not knowing any Supreme Court cases or knowing which magazines she reads.

Although Biden lied and misrepresented, the Democrats have been doing that for more than a century, and are generally not called to order. As you said after the Presidential debate, most viewers are too stupid anyway to understand any of the policy questions.

What people saw was that Ryan allowed himself to be bullied for 1 1/2 hours by both Biden and the moderator, and was unable to do anything about it, other than a couple of meek protests about interruptions. One positive result this had for the Democrats is that it probably re-energized a portion of their base that was demoralized by Obama’s performance during the first debate.

Another was that although Ryan did make some good points (and of course I agree with the commenters about Ryan’s poor positions on some issues), they were lost, because Biden showed more emotion, and emotion sticks more in people’s memories.

Ryan and the Republicans should have been prepared for this. I can’t remember how many talk shows I have watched where there was a Republican and a Democrat on the panel. Almost invariably, the Democrat would constantly interrupt, and prevent the Republican from making his/her points, even if the moderator was neutral or mildly pro-Republican. So much worse with an overtly pro-Democratic moderator. After years of this, it is ineptness to the extreme to be unprepared for this tactic.

Ryan should have been much more assertive, showed some emotion, stood up for himself, and not permitted these constant interruptions. If he had showed some emotion, they would have stopped or have been greatly reduced.

Also, although he made some good points, he said so much that it would be difficult for the average voter to keep up with all he was saying. He should have hammered on a few basic points the fiasco in Libya, the war on the Catholic Church as shown now in health care, the issue of Obamacare, the deficit, and maybe one or two others, regardless of the moderator’s attempts to stop him.

You don’t beat an incumbent by allowing yourself to get pushed around like that.

Little Al on October 12, 2012 at 3:13 pm

Why is everyone giving Paul Ryan a pass on last night’s debate? He was terrible! He had a chance to attack the biggest liar, the biggest fraud, the most corrupt and most incompetent President in our history and he blew it. He had a chance to build on Mitt Romney’s first debate victory and failed. He showed that the Republican plan for the Middle East is just as fallacious as what the Obama Administration has tried and failed miserably. This guy has all the facts and figures, but he doesn’t know how to put them together. The voters don’t have much of a choice in this election – when it comes to the Middle East and illegal immigration, the two sides look like mirror images of one another. The primary Romney strength to get the economy moving upward is that he has better ideas of how to get small businesses to begin growing, investing and hiring again. Obama’s methods are death to small businesses which hire most of the workers in this country.

NormCBS on October 12, 2012 at 3:26 pm

    Norm, Might have been planned to let Joe be Joe, And hopefully a few bidenidms would slip out.

    Billie on October 12, 2012 at 4:45 pm

    Biden cooked his own goose. His interruptions and smirks were worse than Fraud Hannity’s. Ryan showed class, while Biden reminded me of a know-it-all clown. If you can win a debate by acting like an undiciplined 2nd grader, O’Biden won going away. I hope Obama tries the same tactic.

    Jimbo on October 13, 2012 at 1:51 am

You can blame me all you want. Ryan and Romney think there is a difference between the rebels over there, they think the Free Syrian Army are “Freedom Fighters” when they openly admit they are for Sharia Law: “Ward spoke with the leader of one of the jihadi groups, Ahmed al-Abaid who commands several hundred Muslim fundamentalist fighters based in Northern Syria. In an interview with Ward, he said the free Syria he is fighting for will be ruled under Sharia law but denied reports that, under his command, self-appointed Sharia judges were sentencing prisoners to death. Ward gathered evidence, however, and confronted him in a second interview with a propaganda video showing his brigade executing captured Syrian government soldiers. He was startled by the video but defended the verdict. “No, I was not aware. This is the first time that I see this,” he said, but when Ward reminded him that his men were clearly responsible for the execution all he could say was “I really don’t know, what can I say. I can no[t] speak,” he tells Ward.”


Stephen Schochet on October 12, 2012 at 3:39 pm

We have a Beltway Elitist Disease of which Obama is but a symptom. You elect Romney, the basic Arab Spring, Two-State Solution Policy is not changing! It does the conservative movement no good to act like cheerleaders, these issues have to be brought to light and for the first time IMO I am thinking we need a third party, because I now question whether or not conservatives can take over the GOP.

SS: AMEN. I question whether “conservatives” as a whole really care about the Islamic threat. After all, they continue to embrace Grover Norquist, Pat Buchanan, Darrell Issa, and call me a liberal whenever I bring up that liberal Romney is no different from Obama on the Middle East and Israel. And Islam. And they embraced this same BS from Bush for 8 years, then pretend that only Obama is the devil when he embraces the same thing (when he’s supposed to–that’s what liberals do, and conservatives are *supposed* to be against this stuff). DS

Stephen Schochet on October 12, 2012 at 3:43 pm

    I think most knowledgeable people agree that there is not much difference between Romney/Ryan and Obama/Biden on the Middle East, Israel, 2-State “Solution,” nor even terrorism. The similarity between the Republicans and the Democrats was clear enough when Bush was president, and that same path has been followed like a well-worn trail…………… a trail leading to national suicide and accelerated threats to Israel’s security.

    Pseudo-conservative John McCain, though he’s not running for office, is the official cheerleader for the Republican’s Me-Too brand version of Obama’s foreign policy–although it’s also a domestic policy, because Obama’s policy not only calls for advancing the cause of terrorism outside the USA, but it calls for inviting them INTO the USA to promote their terrorist agendas. McCain has ATTACKED conservatives who have voiced their disapproval of Obama’s pro-terrorist agendas; attacks made with venom and vitriol, compared to his virtual genuflection toward Obama and his policies. And McCain and Romney are cut from the identical cloth.

    Thus, the Muslim Brotherhood could not have better friends in high places than McCain, Romney, Ryan, and of course, Obama and Biden. Thanks to them and other politicians in their camp, they are setting the USA up for a sequel to the “World Trade Center” attacks that promises to eclipse the original. As the old George Santayana quotation goes, “those who cannot remember the past [act on it] are condemned to repeat it.”

    Ralph Adamo on October 12, 2012 at 4:32 pm

    I agree with everything you and Debbie said – conservatives are as clueless about Islam and the Middle East as their opponents. They are not against pressuring Israel and Islamo-pandering. They’ll just do it more skillfully than the Democrats. Both sides are hypocrites on this subject. And that is why nothing will change in a Romney White House. More two-state BS, doing nothing (aka sanctions) on Iran and kissing the savage behinds of the Muslim World that hates us. The Syrian rebels aren’t “freedom fighters” as Paul Ryan told us last night – in truth, they want to impose a similar and equally ruthless tyranny upon their country. We should stay out of the conflict there and like Debbie told us the other day, the enemies of the Assad regime will never be our friends! Its a lesson we should take to heart. Republican cowardice on Islam is just as revolting as the Democratic cowardice towards it. This is Mitt Happens’ position and its one reason among others, why I am not voting for him. We deserve much, much better in our next President.

    NormanF on October 12, 2012 at 7:58 pm

Jay Carney will be slowly walking back ” Bidenisms” the next week or so. H can’t undo them all at once, Make O’s man look like a Liar. Such as Biden saying he din’t vote for the 2 wars,When He did vote for them. Maybe walk one back a day?

Billie on October 12, 2012 at 4:42 pm

I would say that Congressman Ryan was far too deferential to Joe Biden. The man warrants not special consideration. Also, Mr. Ryan should have commented on Mr. Biden’s strange behavior. “Joe, do you really think that it is all a joke? Maybe sitting in a safe U.S. Senate seat for decades caused some wood rot upstairs?” “Golly Joe, are you entering your second childhood in front of us?” Did you get coached by Al Gore for this debate? It really shows.” Mr. Biden’s behavior was so strange that it in itself deserved ridicule by Paul Ryan. Why be intimidated by someone who has less going for him upstairs than the average late night janitor. Barack Obama picked Joe Biden because he knew that he represented no competitive threat. He was in no way concerned that such a deficient fellow could wind up as President of the United States. Mr. Biden was a bookend in the U.S. Senate, and he serves the same role now. In Barack Obama’s eyes, it is well worth the occasional gaffe to have a second banana who no one in their right mind would rally behind against him.

Worry01 on October 12, 2012 at 5:16 pm

Joe looked like he had snorted some of Obama’s coke.

Obama looked like he had a hash buzz.

What is going on in the White House?

Panhandle on October 12, 2012 at 5:24 pm

J Bodine, Twitter is a different entity and as it is I like it and it’s cool. You must check it out to see how it works (separate from blogs) and for a timed event it is more suitable than posting here. Check it out to see for yourself. You may like it more than you think you will (as did I).

But a warning…it can be VERY narcissistic. And narcissists love it in their narcissistic way. I laugh when I can spot one though and thank the Lord I am not self-obsessed as they are.

I listened to the debate (I don’t watch TV) and I hated it. Biden’s boorishness came shining through as did Martha (Bradley…for those in Boston who knew her as such…) Raddatz, like douchey David Gregory, was pinch-hitting for the Dems. It all came through.

But Ryan was too tepid, too scripted and too passive. It really annoyed me. I hated that he was double-teamed but I hated that he was not as great as the over-confident “Conservatives” described him. He should have known old Joe would have a canny plan and he did.

I was on the twitters and enjoyed DS’ commentary. I also noticed who was overly exuberant for Ryan (again, I know these peeps do not mean to be dopey, but in the end they are) and who had their critical thinking cap on.

That’s how the modern Democrat plays. It would be nice if the castrato GOP would wake the hell up and start fighting fire with fire but they are too busy pandering and cowering.

I think it’s self-evident that the Romney/Ryan way is the wussy/pussy way. Nice! And after Romney really took it to his “Conservative” opponents in the Primary. NOBODY snatches defeat from the jaws of victory like the lame GOP can!

Skunky on October 12, 2012 at 6:36 pm

“the enormous debt Obama has saddled upon America”?

Why does Obama get blamed for (or credited with) rubber-stamping what Congress sends him? Where is a Joe McCarthy, “B-1” Bob Dornan, or Larry McDonald (the last great Democrat) when you need him?

Dr Dale on October 12, 2012 at 8:36 pm

Dr. Dale, he gets credited with it because of what you said, he rubber stamps instead of sending back.

Homercles82 on October 12, 2012 at 9:37 pm

You know kids, halloween is just around the corner. After watching the debates I think i might have the perfect costumes for our political adversaries.
Romney and Ryan are Batman and Robin, of course. Just think about that for a minute.
Obama as the undead, a Bloodsucking Vampire. He certainly looked the part and plays it well…aaaaaaand…
…Biden!, well at first I was thinking the Mad Dr. Frankenstein (or is that Frankensteen?) but then again he’d be perfect as Dracula’s bug eating servant from the asylum, R.M. Renfield.
Would you trust this man with the BIG RED BUTTON at 3:00 A.M.?

Anyone in the mood to have a little fun with photoshop?
Anyone with better suggestions? Anyone else as tired and worn down with this election as I am?

theShadow on October 12, 2012 at 11:39 pm

I FINALLY realized who Biden’s been reminding me of: an inharmonious blend of Dana Carvey’s Mickey Rooney impersonation (“Pow, zip, the world, baby!”) with Saddam Hussein during the parts of his trial where he would leer and laugh ironically to make a point.

Feel much better now. It’s been bugging me for days.

Kostoglotov on October 12, 2012 at 11:46 pm

Paul Ryan won, he’s going to appeal to the younger swing idiots who don’t have anything invested in SS and Medicare and who can probably aren’t buying Biden’s antics. But the swing voters must be pretty dumb to begin with, so maybe they’ll just be attracted to Ryan’s youth.

David Lanham on October 12, 2012 at 11:51 pm

The debate should move someone? I am amazed that Paul Ryan didn’t ask what job it was that the Iraqis, and Afghanistani’s were to take up? Leaving aside “democratic principles”, it is my thought that the job is protecting themselves from themselves.
Indeed, if it was truly desired to get the Americans out, they would stop killing themselves. They blow one another up with a vengence, each and every participant shouting alluha akbar while pulling the trigger.
Neither Iraq, nor Afghanistan are going to step up to the plate because they cannot. Not only can they not step up to the plate, they will not. The corruption of the regimes is well known. You are looking at a tribally based fuedal system that prevents any reasonable guarantee of success. The killing shall continue, and the threat to the United States will continue to grow.

Dad on October 12, 2012 at 11:59 pm

DL @ 11:51
Don’t forget the women voters especially the “Cougars” who were probably the ones Googleing ‘Paul Ryan shirtless’ 🙂

Seriously, I think Biden with his pushy attitude turned a lot of women off. Probably reminded more than a few of the jerk they married. Paul came off looking like a good Family Man that many wish they had. With the uninformed crowd (most voters) it has to do with emotion rather than substance anyway.

theShadow on October 13, 2012 at 12:05 am

    Yeah, I would like to think older swing women wouldn’t fall for the media’s portrayal of Republicans as mean, but we’re talking about some pretty dumb women if they’re middle-aged and still can’t decide who to vote for. Common sense tells you Obama and Biden shouldn’t even be in the race, but it’s their’s to lose. So I don’t know how to gauge what a country of 50% morons will do, but I guess Ryan will help pull more of the younger swing voters, who may simply be former liberals and who’re now in the process of growing up. I would’ve liked to see Ryan less afraid to cut them both off and get heard a little better, made him look like he could be pushed around, but I suppose it’s better not to get dragged into Biden’s silly behavior. At least he doesn’t look like the idiot.

    David Lanham on October 13, 2012 at 4:27 am

I agree with Worry01, Biden was picked for the very fact Obama saw larger opportunity not having a credible personality to serve along side him. He certainly did not want someone who might interfere with policy strategy important to Obama.
He needed someone who did not have the ability to be anything but led.
It is easier to dismiss an irascible child by making an apology for him, and having other parents nod approvingly, then to be admonished by the childs good behavior in spite of your deeds, that you are a questionable parent.
In this case, both the parent and child are questionable.

Dad on October 13, 2012 at 12:21 am

Stephen Schochet, I agree on the need for a third party. A few years ago, I read about a party called the ‘Loyalist Party’, whose #1 agenda was to be tough on Islam/Muslims. They pretty much had it nailed.

Unlike during the Cold War, when Conservatives were highly accurate about the Communist threat, such is not the case today, so using one’s ‘Conservatism’ as the yardstick to measure how good one is on the problem of Muslims is like trying to calculate weights in terms of inches and miles.

Besides, worldwide, Conservatism involves an embrace of religion, and in the case of Muslim countries, that religion is Islam. In the West, where the battle lines are b/w ‘people of faith’ and Leftist Atheists, Conservatives tend to be on the side of the former, even when that includes Muslims. Therefore, Conservatives are hardly the right vehicle from which to fight Islam.

We need a third party – the Loyalist Party that was there was a good starting model. Their main platform was being anti-Muslim worldwide, closing US borders to Muslim immigration and all illegal immigration, and doing something to get jobs back to the US. In terms of economic policy, they were conservative enough, w/o trying to be Conservative on social issues that would necessitate them taking support of Muslim groups. Their agenda seemed even better than that of the Libertarians. Today, they’d be a 5th or whatever party, but as time moves on, it’s more likely that they’d steal support from both major parties as people get sick of Muslims, but see the 2 parties continue to do nothing about it.

Infidel on October 13, 2012 at 1:31 am

Biden said falsely that Syria is LARGER than Libya. He is a buffon and he proved it!

Alabama Pride on October 13, 2012 at 3:00 am

    Right, exactly!!

    Dave on October 13, 2012 at 10:44 am

The bizarre atmosphere of the debate is only matched by the night of the RNC (convention) when I switched over twice to see what mischief MSNBC was up to. First time, they were counting black faces in the audience, second time a panel was seriously making remarks about a secret language only known to republicans in which are embedded racial slurs in words and statements.
No, it was not a SNL bit!

Rochelle on October 13, 2012 at 1:48 pm

Debbie as soon as I saw the two of them were sitting with Martha like they were on The View I knew Ryan wasnt going to do well. He was getting tag teamed and had trouble interacting. Biden’s rudeness did help mitigate Ryan’s performance at least. Debbie I’m working on the itinerary for your Shabaton. When shall I schedule our nap?

A1 on October 14, 2012 at 5:10 pm

A1, have you already worn out that “doll” we all sent you? Those were reinforced love orifices, fer godsake.

skzion on October 15, 2012 at 12:10 am

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